Curse

Cymboric Treewalker · Sep 19, 2005, 03:35 PM // 15:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tysac Vanguard

You see it, and run into it all the time. It hard to beat without making yourself too weak against other builds as well.

Whats the best way to counter this build, and How does it even work ? In detail...I'm still fairly new to the gvg scene, even though this is an old topic.

A good mesmer will eat him for lunch.

Ollj · Sep 20, 2005, 12:02 AM // 00:02

I only need 4 skills to counter e/mo smiters or IWAY's:

/point
/laught
/taunt
/dance

knives · Sep 20, 2005, 12:09 AM // 00:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by CAT

Well, IMO saying a mesmer is a counter to something is unfair. Mesmers can basically counter ANYTHING as long as their build is right. (air ele spellbreaker spiker maybe not, but give me a break).

This may be common knowledge to some, but I HARDLY get into any groups advertising my mesmer in tombs. If a mesmer can counter anything, then why doesn't every group have atleast one?

smurfhunter · Sep 20, 2005, 12:49 AM // 00:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollj

I only need 4 skills to counter e/mo smiters or IWAY's:

/point
/laught
/taunt
/dance

lol...

Cymboric Treewalker · Sep 20, 2005, 02:28 AM // 02:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by knives

This may be common knowledge to some, but I HARDLY get into any groups advertising my mesmer in tombs. If a mesmer can counter anything, then why doesn't every group have atleast one?

'cause most people playing don't have a clue?

Entropius · Sep 20, 2005, 04:54 AM // 04:54

I play an e/mo healer build. The Ether Renewal concept is the same, so similar shutdown methods should work.

Attacking the enchantments is one way to go about it. If you can time a rend to hit as ether renewal hits, you deny them the energy engine. However, they'll probably get one or two spells off first, refilling 30 or 40 energy. This is enough juice to let them use balth's once, smite hex (good e/mo's should run this), recast zealot's, etc., while waiting on ER to recharge. They can also balth's someone and pull back while waiting on ER to recharge, and if you let them get even four seconds under ER, they've regained 80 energy and you're back where you started.

Straight-out energy drain is not a good way to do it. Between weapon switches, their huge energy pools, and Ether Renewal, if you can devote enough mesmer resources to draining an E/Mo dry, you could have just put that same effort into something else and just killed them.

Snaring the people being smited off of is one solution, especially effective if your team doesn't run many warriors. However, Cripple isn't a solution because of Draw Conditions, and hexes are only effective if your team already can achieve hex saturation.

On defense, Healing Seed and Shielding Hands nullify smite damage.

The combination of high armor targets (using pyro armor, Ward vs Harm, Armor of Earth, Mantra of Flame) to stop ZF, and aggressive spot enchantment removal on warriors (to stop Balth's) or heavy use of Chilblains, is another way to do it.

Simply spreading the hell out helps a lot.

Backfire is a joke. Good teams will throw a Prot Spirit down and just keep going.

Conundrum and Migraine aren't that great. My e/mo healer runs 4 spells with a cast time of 1/4 second; smiters typically run 3. They might be decent if you combine them with interrupts, and only counter balth's/renewal.

Diversion messes up e/mo's like nobody's business, though. The luxury of running ER is that you can cast constantly. A normal character with diversion will just sit there for six seconds, or (at worst) cast different spells waiting on the diverted spell to recharge.

An Ether Renewal-fuelled character, however, has enough energy to cast spells constantly, and to cast all the skills on their bar as fast as they recharge. Shutting skills down helps a lot; so does shutting them down for six seconds, as they can't even use that time to recharge energy like other casters can since they don't need it.

Teams worried about these shutdowns can run breaker on someone, and just call for breaker on the targetted e/mo right before they activate their ether renewal. That'll get them a full energy bar to play with, which should last them quite a while.

Patrograd · Sep 20, 2005, 06:48 AM // 06:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by zehly

Necromancer with Well of Profane works wonders on smite builds.

I would agree with this.

Smiting relies on enchantments, you have to strip them. The team should carry as many enchant removals as it can as a matter of course anyway. An e/mo without his enchants is just scenery. So well of profane (which is the key skill if used properly), rend enchants, stip enchants etc. I wouldnt worry about removing the balth aura from the warriors, as it will remove itself pretty quickly. That effort is better put into the e/mos.

the other thing to remember is that zealots does fire damage, so bring as much prot against fire as you can. Ward against harm? Pryo armour? dragonscale armour or whatever the ranger thing is? Fire nukers are becoming more coomon again now anyway, so these might be good measures to take in any event.

Ka RaTae · Sep 20, 2005, 02:58 PM // 14:58

Another fun way is if you have a couple Necro/mesmers....just Echo Descrate Enchants on the E/Mo. At 16 the damage would be 64 + 21 per Enchant. Since most E/Mo's will have 3 Enchants up all the time that is 127 Damage...so if 2 Necros Team up with Echoed or Arcane Echoed Desecrates...your E/Mo is probably dead. If he is in the middle of his his defend himself cycle, then you may have an issue since RoF will negate some of the damage. So the best way would be to wait till he starts spamming zealots of a warrior then hammer him.

TeK 23 · Sep 20, 2005, 03:30 PM // 15:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollj

I only need 4 skills to counter e/mo smiters or IWAY's:

/point
/laught
/taunt
/dance

That always works.

The funny thing is: If you team doesn't have the build to kill a solo build guy. Just kill all of that persons team members so he's the only person left. Then just run around self-healing calling him and his team n00bs for thinking thats a good build.

They'll leave after 10-15mins of this taunting.

twicky_kid · Sep 20, 2005, 09:46 PM // 21:46

i have accually found a way to out cast their life gain from ether.

to tell you the truth if they removed or lowered the life gain on ether i would be happy with it the way it is. it should be for energy only.

anything that reduces healing like defile flesh or predatory season owns the build. seeing as interrupt rangers are going become domonate even if they didn't change this ether it won't stand a chance much longer.

smurfhunter · Sep 20, 2005, 09:53 PM // 21:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by TeK 23

That always works.

The funny thing is: If you team doesn't have the build to kill a solo build guy. Just kill all of that persons team members so he's the only person left. Then just run around self-healing calling him and his team n00bs for thinking thats a good build.

They'll leave after 10-15mins of this taunting.

what? lol anyway...

actually something i saw mental block do was put spitefull spirit on an ele and bury it with parasitic bond or something. its actually a good idea because eles really spam that stuff. althugh it may not hurt the ele too much because hes running aura of restoration, it does have a cute aoe effect. im guessing doing it to both eles in a double smite team would be pretty uncool. and putting it on a prot monk while you use rangers to shutdown healing monks is cool too.

BTW all of those ideas were from mental block, which actually had a lead on us when they played with 3 hench. it was pretty sad.

oh and let me just squeeze in to the post something else... as an emo, taking windborne does far more than just help you on relic runs. your warrior can go insanely fast if you use it, so like at 4 air you can use it on your tank when he chases people. add some of your own smiting and you are much more effective. i think its better than adding in things like aegis. ^^

Iraqalypse Now · Sep 21, 2005, 05:03 AM // 05:03

I'd just like to point out malaise + wither sucks, if people actually play good casters they carry an empty weapon switch or a -en weapon switch, and just weapon-switch to 0 en and remove the malaise + wither. Ether Lord is what you want to be running, and mesmers can run arcane echo and either echo or mantra of renewal (if i got name wrong its the fast-casting linked one) to spread around the ether lords... i prefer arcane echo and the mantra, such that the ether lord lasts 10 sec and recharges in 10 sec, allows you to cast twice the echoed ether lord, and reapply the non-echo ether lord when it runs out...

Running around in circles, bringing a snare mes, and running ward against foes are good smite hate in most maps other than the actual hall... even if you do end up just running around for 13 minutes before the smite team flawlesses you, you've still accomplished something against the dreaded smite machine - namely, reducing the speed at which they aquire victories. Against smite is the only time you are allowed to take perverse pleasure in stalling... this one time in team arena, I was running straight mes with 16 illusion/15 inspiration with mantra of persistence + crippling anguish, and soloed a smite team for nine or ten minutes... and their shutdown mes used backfire. Backfire sucks, because all it does is force the caster to kite your warriors for ten seconds... and you've accomplished what? Glorified, sucky blackout, that doesn't even work in some situations... like an ele/monk smiter with ether renewal and prot spirit on....

Yichi · Sep 21, 2005, 03:10 PM // 15:10

If youre playing a good necro, youll have desecrate enchantments, seeing as most E/Mo smiters rely on heavy enchanting.

Havent had a problem with using that

Dzan · Sep 21, 2005, 03:27 PM // 15:27

Desecrate Enchantments won't do jack. Wow, dealing maybe 80 damage for 15 mana is a great deal {sarcasm}, but its not going to stop the guy from casting, and it certainly isn't going to kill him.

momo2oo2 · Sep 21, 2005, 05:18 PM // 17:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

until you kill yourself from the rend

hexes are hard to see the icons and know what's really on you. ele/mo are dumb people b/c the build is easy to use so it will be used by more dumb people.

conversion will shut down their spamming spell for at least 3 sec if they don't cast during that time (which they will probly have it in que by the time you cast on them) and 30+ sec if they do fire it off. no spam no dmg.

To say e/mos are dumb people is also dumb. I have Smite Hex/Removal, Purge Conditions, and I'm VERY aware of my hexes/conditions. So Diversion is not a threat.

Having played a lot with a smiter e/mo I can tell you the better counters I have found: Rend <or> a lot of -HP captured conditions with Draw AND high attribute Phantasm, so I can't purge conditions or remove enough hexes. BTW I use to have 673HP, so Backfire is not a problem. Empathy also won't work because E/Mo smiters don't attack...

The Red Knight · Sep 23, 2005, 10:14 AM // 10:14

try this mesmer build in tombs :/ I desecrate emosmiters with this

16 domination 10+1 inspiration 8+1 fast cast
shame
diversion
shatter enchant
drain enchant
e burn
e tap
e draiN
fast res

watch the emo smiter shatter his ether renewal and spam shame and diverison and energy drain skills on him till hes empty

P Shizzle · Sep 23, 2005, 11:52 AM // 11:52

Mantra of Persistence and Imagined Burden make it take a while for them to get to you since smite is all melee skills

-shizzle

The Red Knight · Sep 23, 2005, 12:29 PM // 12:29

Oh kitting the warrior through ward against foes or slowing his attack speed or just any type of snare and or debuff will own a smite warrior pretty hard

Tomjol · Sep 24, 2005, 02:27 PM // 14:27

6 necros, 2 monks

All necros or at least 5 with parasitic bond, FoC, desecrate enchantments

Hex warriors, desecrate enchanments will do about 100 or maybe 140 on all adjacent targets, then FoC to do another 150 or so damage, killing all the warriors, then DE and foc the smiters, using Arcane echo to get an extra foc off.

Oh and for IWAY

All of you stand around ghostly hero, warriors come, all hex, then 3 necs FoC, 2 of them desecrate enchantments, in 3 seconds all the warriors+pets are dead, then take care of their necros.

Yezah · Sep 24, 2005, 08:50 PM // 20:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by smurfhunter

as soon as you see an emo use ether renewal, use rend enchants on them.

I play smiter all the time, and this is probably the most annoying and effective shutdown I have ever been hit with as a smiter (one of the easiest to do too).